Improved Routing Information

[Runway 31]

If it is so important why not give it a go, you may surprise yourself.  I am sure if you get stuck you can ask and will be helped out.

[bratters]

Thanks for the encouragement Runway and I appreciate how helpful folks can be on this forum but at my age you know your strengths and weaknesses.

To be honest I really don't want to get involved (bogged down!) in programming when there are other things of far greater interest to me. I just want my RB to do what is says on the tin.

On behalf of all those in my position I would thank Tarbut for his blunt and selfless reply to Airnav:

"Personally, I want you to update your central server.  I'm perfectly capable of updating my local tables myself, but others aren't."

Exactly.

[DaveReid]

Simple question to Air Nav - Why can't you get this algorithm problem sorted?

AirNav won't answer that question because they would first have to acknowledge that it isn't working - which they haven't so far done, despite the evidence being there for all to see.

Come on Dev, there's no shame in admitting that something has turned out to be more difficult to do than you first anticipated.  Bite that bullet.

[Southwest]

To be honest I really don't want to get involved (bogged down!) in programming when there are other things of far greater interest to me. I just want my RB to do what is says on the tin.

You shouldn't have to get bogged down.  Air Nav should get it sorted, or at least PAY someone with a bit of nowse to get it sorted for them.

I hope Boeing aren't reading this thread!

[tarbat]

On behalf of all those in my position I would thank Tarbut for his blunt and selfless reply to Airnav:

As soon as Airnav send me the instructions for submitting route information, I'll send them the Flybe routes.

[abrad41]

Why is that Chris

Are they to lazy to get them from your post.

I sent you a e-mail, don't know you are still using that address.

Andy

[tarbat]

I sent you a e-mail, don't know you are still using that address.

Best to PM me.

[tarbat]

These:

  <?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" ?>
- <Flight>
  <FlightNumber>AWE925</FlightNumber>
  <Callsign>Cactus 925</Callsign>
- <Leg>
- <Origin>
  <ICAOCode>KPHL</ICAOCode>
  <IATACode>PHL</IATACode>
  <AirportName>PHILADELPHIA (INTERNATIONAL)</AirportName>
  <Country>UNITED STATES</Country>
  </Origin>
- <Destination>
  <ICAOCode>KPDX</ICAOCode>
  <IATACode>PDX</IATACode>
  <AirportName>PORTLAND (INTERNATIONAL)</AirportName>
  <Country>UNITED STATES</Country>
  </Destination>
  <GCDistanceNM>2084</GCDistanceNM>
  <DistanceFromOriginNM>664</DistanceFromOriginNM>
  <DistanceFromDestinationNM>1422</DistanceFromDestinationNM>
  </Leg>
  </Flight>

Okay, a question about these instructions.  Are all fields mandatory?  If not mandatory, do we just exclude the XML tags for that field, or submit an empty value for those tags?

Note that all we really need for Radarbox is FLightID, FROM, TO, VIA, CH Date, so would this be acceptable:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" ?
<Flight><FlightNumber>BEE1053</FlightNumber><Leg><Origin><ICAOCode>EGCC</ICAOCode></Origin><Destination><ICAOCode>EGMH</ICAOCode></Destination></Leg></Flight>
<Flight><FlightNumber>BEE1054</FlightNumber><Leg><Origin><ICAOCode>EGMH</ICAOCode></Origin><Destination><ICAOCode>EGCC</ICAOCode></Destination></Leg></Flight>

[AirNav Support]

Just an update on a few items being discussed here:

As you know the routes in our central database are updated by both Flights Stats and our algorithm.

The algorithm is doing its best to gain some of the missing flight route data but however is no means perfect. It is being worked on and is being fine tuned. It has been taken from our Live Traffic for FS system which has been very popular. Due to the nature of the algorithm relying on many variables to detect routes its not easy and not always perfect (not to mention we need good coverage at each airport for it to work) We are not sitting here and telling you that is will solve all issues with routes but that its the best we can do at the moment. The alogrithm is devloped by Live Traffic Devs who are not on the forum and cannot devote 100% time on this, for that reason we can't give the specifics at the moment.

Those advising us of other addons which look up at other sites, we cannot do this as we need to have relationships with these sites (quite costly) to get this data.

The routes database is designed to be updated by the two methods above and not manually. However we can do bulk adds to the database (though some may get overwritten - this is being looked into). We hope to provide more information soon on how this can be done. Please be patient with us.

[anorak]

Okay, Im a numpty sat at my laptop, how do I find accurate route info and then update my data base?

[tarbat]

Airnav, don't know if this question got missed or something.  I've also PM'd you asking for details on how to submit routes.

Okay, a question about these instructions.  Are all fields mandatory?  If not mandatory, do we just exclude the XML tags for that field, or submit an empty value for those tags?

Note that all we really need for Radarbox is FLightID, FROM, TO, VIA, CH Date, so would this be acceptable:

<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8" ?>
<Flight><FlightNumber>BEE1053</FlightNumber><Leg><Origin><ICAOCode>EGCC</ICAOCode></Origin><Destination><ICAOCode>EGMH</ICAOCode></Destination></Leg></Flight>
<Flight><FlightNumber>BEE1054</FlightNumber><Leg><Origin><ICAOCode>EGMH</ICAOCode></Origin><Destination><ICAOCode>EGCC</ICAOCode></Destination></Leg></Flight>

[AirNav Support]

anorak,

Relax and let RB update the routes. Unless you want perfection you should find most of your flights which have routes to be correct. Some of the routes which do not have routes at all are being worked on using techinques from us.

Tarbat,

From the earlier post :)

"The routes database is designed to be updated by the two methods above and not manually. However we can do bulk adds to the database (though some may get overwritten - this is being looked into). We hope to provide more information soon on how this can be done. Please be patient with us."

[bratters]

Just an update on a few items being discussed here:

As you know the routes in our central database are updated by both Flights Stats and our algorithm.

Hi Airnav - I hear what you are saying but what I fail understand is that Google seems to have more routes data than the two sources you mention above put together.
Many of my missing lo-cost alpha-numeric routes I can find just through Google and if they are in Google, then presumably they are in the public domain by definition.

It just strikes me that Flight Stats and your algorithm are both working hard searching for something that has already been found by someone else.

It can't be that simple so I suspect I'm missing something.

[tarbat]

Hi Airnav - I hear what you are saying but what I fail understand is that Google seems to have more routes data than the two sources you mention above put together.

Which sites does Google find that has the data?

Yes, it's quite easy to manually lookup a single FlightID using any of the following sites:
Libhomeradar
FRL
FlightStats
Flytecom
FlightAware

But to automate that for potentially thousands of FlightIDs each days would probably require a commercial arrangement between Airnav and the site owners.  I guess that would cost money, and some sites may not even allow thousands of lookups each day.  And even then you won't get the alphanumeric FlightIds for Loganair, for example.

FD7 uses all the sites listed above, and limits you to 250 lookups per day.

[AirNav Support]

As already mentioned FD7 is on some uncertain ground with those lookups. Many of the sites are not happy with you using bots to visit there sites and gain route data. A agreement is needed with them, and we cannot do what FD7 has done without any agreements and get away with it.

A quick check of google, it seems to use FlightStats which is what we use :)