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Author Topic: Single Box Network Coverage Areas  (Read 16650 times)

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tarbat

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AirNav Development

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #16 on: February 20, 2011, 02:18:25 PM »
Our answer to all this discussion is quite simple: if you want quality and to use a system which is being used by major world airlines and aicraft operators including access to the world's biggest ads-b network you have to pay. Like anything else on the web there are free alternative but of course not professionaly maintained and some of them with dubious quality.

superspotter

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #17 on: February 20, 2011, 02:43:00 PM »
In answer to Chris11, please do not think for one minute I was being flippant. Yes I live in Europe but I also, travel the world and regularly find myself in Africa, middle east, asia etc. I can fully understand your requirement for the network, I cannot understand the desire for people to use it in a heavily aircraft populated area especially with the inbuilt delay which in my opinion, makes the display quite messy. My opinion I stated!
To answer Runway 31's statement that I may reconsider my outlook if the network was free, no, I would still not subscribe as I only want to see what is in my vicinity, whether I am in Luxembourg as I am at present or in Libreville, Lagos, Nairobi etc where I could be next week!
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Runway 31

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #18 on: February 20, 2011, 02:46:04 PM »
As I said superspotter each to their own.

Alan

Marpleman

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #19 on: February 20, 2011, 03:03:00 PM »
Our answer to all this discussion is quite simple: if you want quality and to use a system which is being used by major world airlines and aicraft operators including access to the world's biggest ads-b network you have to pay. Like anything else on the web there are free alternative but of course not professionaly maintained and some of them with dubious quality.

It's a pity then, that you don't maintain such professionalism with the maintainence of the aircraft database, which despite the heroism of the updaters,remains ignored and ignored and ignored.
To weeks on, and still no fix with respect to downloading what the users want.

There's little point in having a professionaly maintained network, portraying inaccurate and hopelessly old information, if it wasn't for the efforts of a handful of amateur enthusiast,who time and time again have to come to your rescue?

comments like this really annoy me - yes ok - I've admittedly gone totally off subject, but in some way , I haven't................

We want quality............but we are not getting it - quite simple really?

Rant over

Rgds

Rich

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #20 on: February 20, 2011, 07:34:53 PM »
I am keeping the discussion constructive.  When deciding which model of receiver to purchase like everyone else I looked at all the costs associated with each model not just the baseline purchase cost.

I knew what the annual costs would be and decided that the Radarbox suited me from what I wanted from the box, its initial purchase price and any annual additional running costs for the options I wanted.

I agree that individuals who give their data should receive a discount but I also knew what I was getting into when I opted to buy the box and take the network.  Each individual is free to make the choice appropriate to them using whichever baseline they like.

Individuals can opt out of providing the data and can quite freely use other options to see network traffic such as Planeplotter if that is their want.  As has been stated a lot of users are more than happy just looking at their own particular area, that decision could be altered if the costs associated with network provision were reduced and this could also be beneficial to Airnav if more users then shared data, especially when Mlat coverage is considered.

The thread is about someone wanting discounted network because in his view he could provide unique data and my view is that we all in most cases provide unique data and we should all pay the same.   Going onto the cost of network is thread drift which has been covered extensively previously and it is up to each individual to decide whether the costs are agreeable to them or not.  If the cost is not there are other options out there which may be more suitable for some.

You have the purse strings and can make the choice appropriate to you.

Alan

Alan,

Totally agree with all your comments. The 'constructive' comment was only made by 'eggplant'. Wondered where he had been. I seem to remember him trying to stir things up on the same issue some time ago. We all know his views on the Network !

As you say you pays your money and makes your choice. I'm sure Chris11 is not the only person appreciative of Network sharers.

Ian

perezoso

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #21 on: February 20, 2011, 07:36:00 PM »
Our answer to all this discussion is quite simple: if you want quality and to use a system which is being used by major world airlines and aicraft operators including access to the world's biggest ads-b network you have to pay. Like anything else on the web there are free alternative but of course not professionaly maintained and some of them with dubious quality.

Ooops.  I'm back.  I actually was not coming back; but a google to direct me to a another thread here, so I checked this one.

I guess the difference in my perspective is that I perceive that the network is primarily composed of hobbyists, not "professionals".  It'd be interesting to have actual figures on that. I'm talking about the people that own boxes and feed the network - not corporate subscribers.

Now, I guess it is true that some hobbyists just can't stand having anything less than a 'professional' network. But the network has a lot of warts - large coverage gaps - for which you need to recruit and maintain new members to fill.  

Are those people "professionals"?  I suspect that by and large, the answer is no. They are probably hobbyists that have paid substantially for your hardware.

I would be much more sympathetic to AirNav's position if Airnav was expanding network coverage at its own expense. But it isn't.  Instead it is trying to expand its network by inducing people to pay for the privilege of feeding your network.

Maybe I'm in the minority; but it seems to me to be almost an abusive relationship that you want to develop with your clients. (Here I mean those clients that own and operate boxes that share on the network.)

What I think is that it's probably just a matter of time before an alternative network saps away AirNav's momentum (and limits or even reverses its network growth) unless AirNav can figure out a way to be more responsive to folks like me. Sorry, I just can't get any warm fuzzy feelings about a company that asks me to whip out my credit card every week for the privilege of feeding them their product.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 07:42:43 PM by perezoso »

AirNav Development

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #22 on: February 20, 2011, 07:49:56 PM »
Marpleman: you don't need to write the same thing over and over again week after week.

We have already told users that RadarBox software will have an upgrade with the database requests implemented once ShipTrax software is finished. We can't do it now because both applications share the same source code.

The work done by the updaters team is amazing and continues day after day. We have released a new navdata.db3 which tries remedy the situation for now knowing that a definitive solution will only happen when RadarBox gets a new upgrade (explained above).

AirNav Support

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #23 on: February 20, 2011, 08:01:31 PM »
This topic comes up from time to time and people forget a few things:

1.) When the network was launched we were the 1st network out there and we did think about whether a share and get network data free would work or whether it had to be paid for. (Some of you won't believe this :) but some of the earlier versions did have some text which indicated this could be the case)

2.) We did try and think, if a customer is sharing do we just give them free network data even though they might be sharing the same data that 50 other users on the network are at that moment or whether they only get one flight per day. This is not easy to manage or think of particular rules, enforce them and if we went down this path it would also annoy customers in low traffic, not unique areas.

3.) Some users believe the data being passed from them to us and then back through the network is a simple process and should be free. This isn't the case and with a few numbers you can work out the cost of bandwidth we need to pay and servers, support to keep this running. One way or another there has to be a cost passed back.

4.) Once the network was released we did listen to customers and reduced the price substantially for the network.

I am sure you can see from the above its not a case of us not listening but more of a case where there is cost involved and it has to be passed back one way or another.
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Marpleman

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #24 on: February 20, 2011, 09:03:43 PM »
Marpleman: you don't need to write the same thing over and over again week after week.

We have already told users that RadarBox software will have an upgrade with the database requests implemented once ShipTrax software is finished. We can't do it now because both applications share the same source code.

The work done by the updaters team is amazing and continues day after day. We have released a new navdata.db3 which tries remedy the situation for now knowing that a definitive solution will only happen when RadarBox gets a new upgrade (explained above).

I'm afraid that I do have to write the same thing over and over again though, as again and again, you promise to act by releasing a revised download of the new database in a week or so, but today come back and once again tell us it will be dealt with when Shiptrax is released - why bother to act like you are going to do something, when you clearly are not??

I can't believe there are not more members bemoaning this total lack of resource for a product that is actually on the commercial market place, compared to something that has yet to be launched?


AirNav Support

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #25 on: February 20, 2011, 09:25:07 PM »
Marpleman,

The new database update to rectify the issues in the ealier one released two weeks ago is not what dev is talking about. That will still be released soon.
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Marpleman

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #26 on: February 20, 2011, 09:46:17 PM »
Marpleman,

The new database update to rectify the issues in the ealier one released two weeks ago is not what dev is talking about. That will still be released soon.

Fair enough - although it wasn't obvious to me!

I look forward to being able to download the release soon then??

One week? Two weeks?

eggplant

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #27 on: February 20, 2011, 10:01:36 PM »

Alan,

Totally agree with all your comments. The 'constructive' comment was only made by 'eggplant'. Wondered where he had been. I seem to remember him trying to stir things up on the same issue some time ago. We all know his views on the Network !

As you say you pays your money and makes your choice. I'm sure Chris11 is not the only person appreciative of Network sharers.

Ian

Ian,

I take offence at your accusation that I "stir things up".  As an AN customer I am entitled to an opinion. In my posts I have merely stated my thoughts appropriate to the respective thread. If that "stirs thing up" (in your opinion), so be it. I don't see why I should be damned for stating my opinion. I would appreciate it if you could refrain from puerile comments in future. I look forward to an apology from you, though I won't hold my breath waiting ! Do you really think Alan's comment " it's not like it's forced on you" is constructive ?

Sigh
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Runway 31

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #28 on: February 21, 2011, 08:50:20 AM »
Eggplant it is easy to take one phrase from a reply and take it out of context, please read the whole reply and the follow ups and dont be selective.

Alan

EK01

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Re: Single Box Network Coverage Areas
« Reply #29 on: February 21, 2011, 10:29:50 AM »
Eggplant it is easy to take one phrase from a reply and take it out of context, please read the whole reply and the follow ups and dont be selective.

Alan

Alan,

As I said, it's ONLY eggplant and I think we have all read his views on this matter many, many times already. I actually thought that AN had banned the guy after his last lot of rants on the subject. No such luck, eh.

Eggplant,

You are right about one thing though, you  needn't hold your breath waiting for an apology !

Ian