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Author Topic: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.  (Read 13112 times)

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daveg4otu

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The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« on: May 16, 2009, 02:17:40 PM »
My ANRB -  3 weeks old , has already had to  make one trip back to W&S for repair - died after just 4 days  initially...returned, fixed , back to me a week ago - just died (very suddenly)again today .


(Told at time of repair  about "Filters" & static - mods will be made etc.....)


When I say " died I mean - range gone from 150-200 miles  to  20/30....activity at 10% of  what it should be.

Spoke to W&S on phone just now - it's got to go back again  on Monday.....


Setup is  thus....Radar box in room-- antenna ( a magmount type MD1105) on  Biscuit tin on flat roof of same room  on a small(3 feet)  stack  of   bricks(so maybe 12 feet AGL)...overall height about 400  amsl overlooking Lyme bay .

Weather at time of failure -  showers/wind about 20-30 knots from SW .


My question is this ... is it static  via the antenna  causing this? - or is there a  more deepseated cause (design flaw perhaps)?

I struggle to see how  static is going to cause this - after all   any antenna  is exposed to wind/rain etc .....if static was going to do this - then I might expect  my scanner, Digibox and any other  radio rx/tx  to  suffer.

As a radio Ham I have had in the past all manner of antennas  up in the sky - and other than pulling   everything when there was lightning about  for safety - I have never had to take any kind of  extra precautions


I need to  find a solution to this as I would like to  have the thing in continuous  use rather than it spending 50% of the time being fixed.


Any thoughts on this would be very welcome.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2009, 02:19:16 PM by daveg4otu »
5 Miles N of BHD at 50.28.28 N/3.30.43W...400ft amsl.

Hampshire, Devon, Dorset and Isle of Wight  Airfields Websites.....
http://devonairfields.tripod.com/index.htm

gzerovti

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2009, 02:29:10 PM »
Hi Dave,

Sorry to hear about your double problem. Mine is still in at W&S at the moment.

I am also a radio ham and agree with all you say.

If it had happened last night I could have understood it as we had terrific thunder and some lightening.

Your symptoms are exactly the same as mine. It died all of a sudden. At 14.00 it was perfect and at 15.00 gone.

Weather here was sunny, part cloud and dry.

I have the Radar extender antenna up on the chimney stack.


Hope you get it sorted soon. I hope I get mine back soon as well it is 10 days away now.

Regards

Terry
G0VTI
G0VTI - On the flight path to EGNM

daveg4otu

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2009, 03:08:17 PM »
Commiserations Terry - not that  that helps....hope it comes back quickly.

To be fair to W&S  I got mine back  very quickly after the first return- and they did keep in touch - they phoned to say it  had been dispatched etc.

If anything this time round it is probably worse than the previous episode showing right now  only one contact ...and that is almost overhead!


Sad thing is that I  was just saying  to myself how well it was  going - yesterday - I left it running  from about 8 am to 11pm and it logged over 1500 flights.
Today  up to  the "death"  it was at 980....since then (about 1400) only another 12.


Great piece of gear if it can be made to operate consistently.

73
5 Miles N of BHD at 50.28.28 N/3.30.43W...400ft amsl.

Hampshire, Devon, Dorset and Isle of Wight  Airfields Websites.....
http://devonairfields.tripod.com/index.htm

AirNav Support

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2009, 03:18:27 PM »
Hi Dave,

Firstly we very sorry to hear of the troubles you are having. The second failure might be due to the repair or another static spike. We cannot say untill our team looks at it. If its due to the repair thens that's unfortunate issue and hopefully it will be full rectified.

If its due to static again we recommend your antenna is ground or purchase an antenna with a grounded design or is built to limit static build up. Or purchase a mast amp, pre amp which should help bleed any static away from the RadarBox.

Windy conditions are actually perfect for static build up, cars, aircraft all pick up static in that way. This is not a design fault, if was there would be hundreds of customers here with the same issue. Yes it has been a concidence there has been a few at the same time, which could be related to weather. However cutomers need to be aware of the static risk in any antenna and to make sure you look for ones which limit static build up.

Terry:

I think you emailed as well regarding when your RB is coming back. As mentioned on here the return time is usually 5-10 working days.
Contact Customer/Technical support via:
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daveg4otu

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2009, 03:41:25 PM »
 If wind = static - then  running this thing in any mobile  config  would  be problematical....and - as it happens  it is a lot less windy today than it has been   earlier (over w/end  had gusts to 50 mph).

Guess I'll have to wait and see what the outcome is - but I do think it's a pity that this problem  seems to occur .

 
5 Miles N of BHD at 50.28.28 N/3.30.43W...400ft amsl.

Hampshire, Devon, Dorset and Isle of Wight  Airfields Websites.....
http://devonairfields.tripod.com/index.htm

daveg4otu

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2009, 04:01:55 PM »
Just to add the  Lightning monitor station on the IOW  has "no storms detected"  over the past few hours - only strikes are a few in mid France.

Had there been excessive levels of static - one might expect to see some T-storm activity in the UK mainland..


For  those   haven't seen   it before....

http://www.isleofwightweather.co.uk/live_storm_data.htm
5 Miles N of BHD at 50.28.28 N/3.30.43W...400ft amsl.

Hampshire, Devon, Dorset and Isle of Wight  Airfields Websites.....
http://devonairfields.tripod.com/index.htm

AirNav Support

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2009, 04:09:42 PM »
Dave,

Lightning is the frst thing people think of when static electricity is mentioned. Lightning is an extreme occurance of this. Statis build up regardless occurs all the time.

We really advise any customer (infact anyone putting up an antenna) to understand the risk assiocated with static build up.

Have a quick read of:

http://www.keohi.com/keohihdtv/hdreception/antenna_grounding.html
Contact Customer/Technical support via:
http://www.airnavsystems.com/contact.html
[email protected]

daveg4otu

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2009, 04:45:20 PM »
ANS ...yes I've read that - and dozens like it over the years.

This should be sortable without resorting to masthead preamps...and as I already have a range of over 200 miles(when working) that is an expense that I would consider as  pointless.

I think the point that needs addressing - if  static spikes are the problem - is- why are a few users  having this problem - whilst apparently most are not?
Perhaps the box needs more robust internal   protection if the problem keeps on occurring .


It would be interesting to know - how many are using Magmount type antennas  outside - with unearthed ground planes?(A good number I would guess)

If so - any problems?

In addition I would like to hear any opinions on an efficient method of  grounding  a magmount ...my idea is to  try   by removing the  protective rubber shield on the mount - so that the magnet makes  direct electrical contact with the GP (in this case a biscuit tin lid ) and then ground the tin via an earth spike.

Or ..................?
5 Miles N of BHD at 50.28.28 N/3.30.43W...400ft amsl.

Hampshire, Devon, Dorset and Isle of Wight  Airfields Websites.....
http://devonairfields.tripod.com/index.htm

AirNav Support

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2009, 05:10:42 PM »
Hi Dave,

"I think the point that needs addressing - if  static spikes are the problem - is- why are a few users  having this problem - whilst apparently most are not?
Perhaps the box needs more robust internal   protection if the problem keeps on occurring ."

Everyone setup is different, different antennas (some which are designed to limit static), different weather conditions etc..

Regarding changing anything, in the newer builds of RB we have increased protection against static (it was already there but we have increased it). Regardless even then if you subject any device to a large static voltage it will suffer damage.
Contact Customer/Technical support via:
http://www.airnavsystems.com/contact.html
[email protected]

abrad41

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2009, 07:59:22 AM »
Hi

I have had my RB for close to a year now and never had a problem, I have used this mobile and I use a external antenna at home, the box get connected and disconnected to use mobile. Seems strange that a lot of people on here has had no problems and just a small amount has.

Cheers

arlyn9391

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #10 on: May 20, 2009, 02:05:22 AM »
My ANRB -  3 weeks old , has already had to  make one trip back to W&S for repair - died after just 4 days  initially...returned, fixed , back to me a week ago - just died (very suddenly)again today .


(Told at time of repair  about "Filters" & static - mods will be made etc.....)


When I say " died I mean - range gone from 150-200 miles  to  20/30....activity at 10% of  what it should be.

Spoke to W&S on phone just now - it's got to go back again  on Monday.....


Setup is  thus....Radar box in room-- antenna ( a magmount type MD1105) on  Biscuit tin on flat roof of same room  on a small(3 feet)  stack  of   bricks(so maybe 12 feet AGL)...overall height about 400  amsl overlooking Lyme bay .

Weather at time of failure -  showers/wind about 20-30 knots from SW .


My question is this ... is it static  via the antenna  causing this? - or is there a  more deepseated cause (design flaw perhaps)?

I struggle to see how  static is going to cause this - after all   any antenna  is exposed to wind/rain etc .....if static was going to do this - then I might expect  my scanner, Digibox and any other  radio rx/tx  to  suffer.

As a radio Ham I have had in the past all manner of antennas  up in the sky - and other than pulling   everything when there was lightning about  for safety - I have never had to take any kind of  extra precautions


I need to  find a solution to this as I would like to  have the thing in continuous  use rather than it spending 50% of the time being fixed.


Any thoughts on this would be very welcome.


Thank you for sharing your sentiments with us but I really don't know if it is static  via the antenna  that causing this or is there a  more deep seated cause?




_________________
Furnace Filter

malc41

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2009, 10:11:12 AM »
Dave

Would you keep us updated as to what goes on and any findings that come to light

15 Miles East of EGNJ

daveg4otu

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2009, 11:40:37 AM »
Yes  - I will -.....

The box has  gone back to W&S - it arrived with them yesterday so hopefully it will back here fairly quickly.

In the meantime I am in the process of adding an earth stake connected to the Antenna coax  shield...see what happens with that.

Then if there are any further problems I guess it will mean making up one of Karl's little gizmos (see the  thread about grounding antennas)...but hopefully that  won't(shouldn't) be needed.
5 Miles N of BHD at 50.28.28 N/3.30.43W...400ft amsl.

Hampshire, Devon, Dorset and Isle of Wight  Airfields Websites.....
http://devonairfields.tripod.com/index.htm

TedLoon

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2009, 06:50:49 PM »
daveg4otu
               unlucky mate and sorry to hear about your RB going wonky again. I think you have great patience in your posts when asking questions ETC. I understand it's a fairly new product but some of the reponses beggers belief. I myself hav not had any problems with my unit as yet (1 month old) it does however stop working and I have to restart it from time to time. I for one am still waiting for an explantion as to how to ground the anntena i'm about to erect 20 foot above my chimney(sod the neighbours). Anywy here's hoping for a reply from some radio/ham expert.

Anyway daveg4otu if ET flys over in UFO1 i'll let you know. hope you get your RB back soon.......... p.s hundreds of members on here but only a few post...... so come on NONE POSTERS don't be shy


colin

davjhedges

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Re: The "Static" and "Filters" problem etc.
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2009, 07:23:24 PM »
hi dave.got my rb back from w&s yesterday,second repair since easter,exibiting same symptoms both times,exactly the same as you.first time blown front end filter,second ,dry filter and usb joints had to be resoldered.the rb is working fine at the moment,am concerned about this static issue, and intend disconnecting external aerial at end of each session.
regards,davidh.