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Author Topic: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions  (Read 33558 times)

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Deadcalm

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #15 on: February 14, 2009, 12:08:34 PM »
Interesting.  Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price.  Nice it may be, but well beyond my available funds, monthly or otherwise.  And as most of us are hobbyists, be we retired ex- Industry professionals or not, we are ineligible for "Professional" access anyway.

So the sole concession is monthly payment for we personal users, amounting to the same annual price anyway.  How is this calculated?  Is there any scope for variation, and why (if we have to pay) can we not subscribe via a "pay per network use " policy?  What are our concessions if the network fails (as it has done)?

Sorry, I for one feel it's all a bit too much to swallow, and my occasional forays into the network for specific purpose just don't make it worth the money, and so will not be renewing my networking subscription in its current form.

Woodpecker makes some valid points on the other thread pertaining to this subject.

DC
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viking9

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #16 on: February 14, 2009, 12:21:47 PM »
DC,

You have echoed my sentiments entirely.

When one considers that much of the network info is provided by 'amateurs' and the aircraft info is often very incomplete, being gleaned from another amateur organisation GAS, it's not a very good deal.

Tom.
Tom
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robbieinderry

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #17 on: February 14, 2009, 12:31:46 PM »
Interesting.  Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price.  Nice it may be, but well beyond my available funds, monthly or otherwise.  And as most of us are hobbyists, be we retired ex- Industry professionals or not, we are ineligible for "Professional" access anyway.

So the sole concession is monthly payment for we personal users, amounting to the same annual price anyway.  How is this calculated?  Is there any scope for variation, and why (if we have to pay) can we not subscribe via a "pay per network use " policy?  What are our concessions if the network fails (as it has done)?

Sorry, I for one feel it's all a bit too much to swallow, and my occasional forays into the network for specific purpose just don't make it worth the money, and so will not be renewing my networking subscription in its current form.

Woodpecker makes some valid points on the other thread pertaining to this subject.

DC
it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price. are we all stupid fools
nice one boys.
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robbieinderry

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #18 on: February 14, 2009, 12:34:11 PM »
DC,

You have echoed my sentiments entirely.

When one considers that much of the network info is provided by 'amateurs' and the aircraft info is often very incomplete, being gleaned from another amateur organisation GAS, it's not a very good deal.

Tom.
are we saying if the internet gos down so does the planes NEVER.?
The name is robbie.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/derryradiogroup/
Radio is hobby and one that can bring hours of enjoyment, build friendships and provide an escape from the trials of everyday life.

AirNav Support

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #19 on: February 14, 2009, 02:28:35 PM »
Ok once again looks like some customers are confused. So lets make this clear:

RadarBox at the moment does NOT send Live data to the network server. Only 5 minute delayed is sent. Therefore if your not a proffesional version member you will not be sharing Live data so you are not helping the proffesional network.

The Proffesional network requires customers to sign up and be approved to access this Live data. So while we have announced this on the forum 99.99% of customers reading will not be affected.
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EK01

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #20 on: February 14, 2009, 02:41:11 PM »
 
It really is time for some of you guys to stop moaning. You requested a monthly subscription and you have been granted that request. The annual subsrciption is only 60 euros. Good grief, even in these hard times it's hardly going to break the bank. You now have a couple of options and not just a straight forward 'take it or leave' situation. Most of us are probably old enough to remember what our hobby used to be like and appreciate the advances we now have. Well done Airnav and keep up the good work !

DaveReid

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2009, 03:40:00 PM »
Would I pay the professional fee to have access to the live data?  I don't think so, as it isn't going to make that much difference to me when viewing traffic outside my live coverage area.

Don't assume that you (or any of us, come to that) would necessarily have the option to do this even if we wanted to.

I infer from the announcement that, just like the real-time FAA/ASDI feed, users will have to justify their use of the data and sign an agreement undertaking to observe restrictions on what they do with it, albeit that in this case the agreement will be with AirNav rather than the FAA.
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viking9

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2009, 03:46:37 PM »
Ok once again looks like some customers are confused. So lets make this clear:

RadarBox at the moment does NOT send Live data to the network server. Only 5 minute delayed is sent. Therefore if your not a proffesional version member you will not be sharing Live data so you are not helping the proffesional network.

The Proffesional network requires customers to sign up and be approved to access this Live data. So while we have announced this on the forum 99.99% of customers reading will not be affected.

Sorry AirNav, I'm still a bit confused. You say that none of us is providing live data. So where is it being delayed? Where will the "live data" come from that the professionals will be using?
Tom
Bury St Edmunds, Suffolk UK
15 miles SE of EGUN
32 miles SE of MAM > DIKAS track
http://www.viking9.co.uk

Deadcalm

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2009, 03:56:00 PM »
I hardly think that it's a case of moaning.  And I didn't ask for a monthly subscription.  What I asked for is a robust system which does what it says on the tin, and the opportunity, if I have to continue paying for it, to do so as and when I use it.

I've had my RadarBox for almost a year, and enjoyed using it, despite the fact that the software is a bit flaky, and the benefit gained from the network in my case) negligible.  I've seen the performance of the software (again, in my case) lacking, and I've also seen the information obtained from the network when I have used it to be questionable.  These are issues that I've aired on this forum, and have had a modicum of support.

When you live abroad, on a pension, with what savings you have earning less and less, and with the exchange rate fluctuating between poor and hopeless, you look twice at niceties like the ongoing cost of subscribing to a network which doesn't properly serve its purpose, and which you rarely use.

And if I rightly choose to take issue with the suppliers about the service provided on a forum such as this in order to try and get the supplier (and other users) into discussion, it's not moaning but drawing attention to inadequacies so that all may benefit.  Some of you, I think, heap unbridled praise on the manufacturers of this equipment without really considering the issues at hand.  They are not in it for the benefit of their health, but to make a profit.  As customers we should have input into the equation.

Yes, the concept is good, but it is certainly not infallible, and could be implemented in a better way.  Until it is, I've made my decision, rightly or wrongly, to not renew my subscription.  My choice.  Maybe things will change over the ensuing year, in which case I'll review my decision.  I'll watch with interest.

DC
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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2009, 04:32:01 PM »

Don't assume that you (or any of us, come to that) would necessarily have the option to do this even if we wanted to.


Not arguing with that - it was a hypothetical question.

DC, you seem to be confusing a hobby programme with what you would expect from a professional piece of kit.  Do you have any software that works exactly as you think that it should?  I don't for sure.  I think that your description of the software as "flaky" is very harsh and I would be surprised if you continued to use it if it was so. At least I have daily contact with the suppliers and I am confident that they are listening to what we say and will strive to make us all happy - although in reality, I know that it would be impossible to make everybody happy :-)  Certainly, I gave up long ago the hope that I would be able to have such a dialogue with Kinetic Aviation regarding the SBS-1.

I wonder if you have ever been involved working with Industry for the provision of flight safety critical information - or even for simulation of such data as used for training.  I can tell you exactly what you would get for GBP399 plus 60 Euro's a month - not a lot - lol.

I hope that you are able to continue to get enjoyment from your RadarBox, in spite of your obvious problems with the software and your perception of its inadequacies.  You save your money by not renewing your subscription and I'll continue to enjoy the unique Network function of RadarBox :-)

And DC, I'm not having a go at you, but you do seem to be banging the same drum over and over again old chap.  I think that we all know exactly how you feel!
 

Balding Badger

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #25 on: February 14, 2009, 04:59:00 PM »
Hi folks!
Sorry to be a bit thick on this one but we are talking here about flights picked up via the internet? Do I take it that 'overhead traffic' will still be real time?
Thanks
BB

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #26 on: February 14, 2009, 05:23:08 PM »
Hi BB,

Traffic picked up by your antenna will always be live :-)

Network traffic is delayed by 5 minutes - unless you can prove that you are a professional user and can afford the subscription for real-time Network traffic.

The port 30003 output, used by PlanePlotter and Squawkbox is live at the moment (a mistake in programming) but will be delayed by 5 minutes when the next software version comes out.

AirNav Development

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #27 on: February 14, 2009, 08:52:06 PM »
"Interesting.  Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price."

Deadcalm, I'm not sure you read the message correctly: real-time data is only available FOR PROFESSIONALS and FOR PROFESSIONAL USE. It is not a pricing problem: if a user is able to pay the Professional Network price but is not professional he will not be approved.

Fenris

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #28 on: February 14, 2009, 11:01:58 PM »
"Interesting.  Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price."

Deadcalm, I'm not sure you read the message correctly: real-time data is only available FOR PROFESSIONALS and FOR PROFESSIONAL USE. It is not a pricing problem: if a user is able to pay the Professional Network price but is not professional he will not be approved.

Well, I'm a professional, just not in the aviation industry ;-)

Now, can you tell us the criteria used for deciding whether a Professional subscription will be granted? I assume that such information is not secret.....

AirNav Development

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Re: New RadarBox Network Access Solutions
« Reply #29 on: February 15, 2009, 02:40:59 AM »
"Well, I'm a professional, just not in the aviation industry ;-)"

Can you tell us for what airline/company you work for?

When someone applied to get real-time data he/she has to meet the criteria below and sign a document with all his details. This document has been prepared by our legal team.

Definition of a RadarBox Professional Network user:

“Paragraph 1: A RadarBox Professional Network User is a professional aviation organization with an established flight dispatch or planning function that requires near real time positional flight tracking capabilities. This organization must have direct responsibility for dispatching or tracking aircraft it owns or be contracted by the owner of the aircraft to do so. Examples are airlines, regional air carriers, air taxis, any organization providing dispatch or tracking functions for aircraft owners, flight operation centers, government users and professional flight planning service providers.”

“Paragraph 2: A Government User is a national, federal, state or local government organization, airport authority or authorized organizations acting on behalf of a Government organization.”