AirNav Systems Forum
AirNav RadarBox and RadarBox24.com => AirNav RadarBox and RadarBox24.com Discussion => Topic started by: AirNav Development on February 13, 2009, 10:18:55 PM
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We are happy to announce that we have expanded the possibilities for our users to access RadarBox Network Data.
This access is now organized in two different modes, Personal and Professional.
Personal mode has 5 minute delayed data while the newly created Professional mode has real-time data. Both have 2 subscription options, monthly and annually.
We have been approached by several airlines and airport related companies asking to access our ADS-B network data in real-time. Because of this we have created the Professional mode. It is to be used only by professionals. We require a professional user to sign a document stating for what company he/she works and giving details on how the software will be used. This will work exactly as the US/Canadian ASDI Real-time flight data access is authorized.
RadarBox Network Personal:
- Annual - EUR € 59.95 per year
- Monthly - EUR € 7.95 per month
RadarBox Network Professional
Unlimited REAL-TIME Access
- Annual - EUR € 1399.95 per year
- Monthly - EUR € 99.95 per month
All the details available at:
http://www.airnavsystems.com/RadarBox/order.html
Please note that Personal access continues to be free for the first year and the annual price is the same. Both option also include unlimited access (absolutely no time restrictions).
As usual any comments are welcome.
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Well, I'll be first to congratulate Airnav on this excellent response to user feedback. Not only does it address concerns from users like me that can't justify a full years access, but it opens up the option for those that really need real-time access.
As always, Airnav have proven that they listen to their customers. Now, roll-on v2.10 ;)
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Hi there, This sounds great!
Can a normal person apply for the 'Pro' Version?
or does it have to be companys etc...?
Johnn
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More to the point, how to fund it for a normal person :)
"Money, that was the problem. He'd tried everything, he'd even been to the bank. 'Don't be a fool' they said, 'Put that gun down!'"
With apologies to Spike Milligan....
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I dont really know what to make of this, and dont misunderstand me, I am very happy for the current situation however, it seems to me that when this professional system is launched we will be working for AIRNAVSYSTEMS using our time, electricity and expertise and then have to pay for using the network. This just seems a bit illogical to me.
I would really appreciate hearing your thoughts on this.
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Great stuff airnav
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I dont really know what to make of this, and dont misunderstand me, I am very happy for the current situation however, it seems to me that when this professional system is launched we will be working for AIRNAVSYSTEMS using our time, electricity and expertise and then have to pay for using the network. This just seems a bit illogical to me.
I would really appreciate hearing your thoughts on this.
Hamish,
It's really a matter of choice :-)
I would like something for nothing - always - but there's no such thing as a free lunch! These pricing options are very flexible and should meet the need of all users. You can choose to have access to the Network data, to share, or not to share, so I don't think that you can say fairer than that. As far as you working for AirNav by supplying data, I look at it from a different perspective - I'm benefiting from the further development of the Network that is bound to be demanded by professional users paying the professional fee. By paying a nominal fee, I'm able to see exactly what they see with the only disadvantage that the Network data will be delayed by 5 minutes - I can live with that.
Would I pay the professional fee to have access to the live data? I don't think so, as it isn't going to make that much difference to me when viewing traffic outside my live coverage area. Would I pay half the cost of the professional fee for live data - no I don't think so either.
I'm sure that AirNav are very happy that we are sharing our data on the Network, but if we stop sharing, do you really think that's going to make much difference? You could probably cover the whole of the UK with around 10 RadarBoxes - maybe less.
Illogical, no I don't think so - I'm happy :-)
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Pretty cool this one. Just a question: Are these professional subscribers sharing there data with us (with 5-minutes delay of course), or are they just receiving data from the network.
Just a thought.
Boris
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If they are using RadarBox, then I guess that they will be sharing data too.
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And of course, all data is uploaded to the Airnav server in near real-time - every 10 seconds. So, it's not strictly a real-time service, but a NEAR real-time service.
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I am very pleased that airnav have put a monthly option in. My sharing is now back on, I must admit I did miss the full network while I was only just using my box. I agree with Tarbat "As always, Airnav have proven that they listen to their customers. Now, roll-on v2.10 ;)"
Stuart
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Hamish,
It's really a matter of choice :-)
I would like something for nothing - always - but there's no such thing as a free lunch! These pricing options are very flexible and should meet the need of all users. You can choose to have access to the Network data, to share, or not to share, so I don't think that you can say fairer than that. As far as you working for AirNav by supplying data, I look at it from a different perspective - I'm benefiting from the further development of the Network that is bound to be demanded by professional users paying the professional fee. By paying a nominal fee, I'm able to see exactly what they see with the only disadvantage that the Network data will be delayed by 5 minutes - I can live with that.
Would I pay the professional fee to have access to the live data? I don't think so, as it isn't going to make that much difference to me when viewing traffic outside my live coverage area. Would I pay half the cost of the professional fee for live data - no I don't think so either.
I'm sure that AirNav are very happy that we are sharing our data on the Network, but if we stop sharing, do you really think that's going to make much difference? You could probably cover the whole of the UK with around 10 RadarBoxes - maybe less.
Illogical, no I don't think so - I'm happy :-)
[/quote]
I look at it from a different perspective - I'm benefiting from the further development of the Network that is bound to be demanded by professional users paying the professional fee.
Thank you for your thoughts and yes, you have a valid point.
Hamish
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I love the radar box.....
many thx support for the different options:)
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Well, I'll be first to congratulate Airnav on this excellent response to user feedback. Not only does it address concerns from users like me that can't justify a full years access, but it opens up the option for those that really need real-time access.
As always, Airnav have proven that they listen to their customers. Now, roll-on v2.10 ;)
Chris,
I'm intriqued about your 'monthly' Network requirements. Is this based upon the time off you have per month or based upon 'predicted weather' - i.e blue skies?
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Well done Airnav you have given the "amatuer" user a payment option following the discussions. You listened didn't ignore the thoughts and came up with a soloution I say again well done. I think in the end we will all benefit from more users being on the system. I also await v 2.10 and all the other versions that hopefully follow on from that one.
I love this device as a plane spotter the hobby has been improved beyond my dreams I'll pay to keep using the Network as I enjoy clicking on my smartview options and seeing aircraft around the world.
John
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Interesting. Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price. Nice it may be, but well beyond my available funds, monthly or otherwise. And as most of us are hobbyists, be we retired ex- Industry professionals or not, we are ineligible for "Professional" access anyway.
So the sole concession is monthly payment for we personal users, amounting to the same annual price anyway. How is this calculated? Is there any scope for variation, and why (if we have to pay) can we not subscribe via a "pay per network use " policy? What are our concessions if the network fails (as it has done)?
Sorry, I for one feel it's all a bit too much to swallow, and my occasional forays into the network for specific purpose just don't make it worth the money, and so will not be renewing my networking subscription in its current form.
Woodpecker makes some valid points on the other thread pertaining to this subject.
DC
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DC,
You have echoed my sentiments entirely.
When one considers that much of the network info is provided by 'amateurs' and the aircraft info is often very incomplete, being gleaned from another amateur organisation GAS, it's not a very good deal.
Tom.
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Interesting. Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price. Nice it may be, but well beyond my available funds, monthly or otherwise. And as most of us are hobbyists, be we retired ex- Industry professionals or not, we are ineligible for "Professional" access anyway.
So the sole concession is monthly payment for we personal users, amounting to the same annual price anyway. How is this calculated? Is there any scope for variation, and why (if we have to pay) can we not subscribe via a "pay per network use " policy? What are our concessions if the network fails (as it has done)?
Sorry, I for one feel it's all a bit too much to swallow, and my occasional forays into the network for specific purpose just don't make it worth the money, and so will not be renewing my networking subscription in its current form.
Woodpecker makes some valid points on the other thread pertaining to this subject.
DC
it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price. are we all stupid fools
nice one boys.
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DC,
You have echoed my sentiments entirely.
When one considers that much of the network info is provided by 'amateurs' and the aircraft info is often very incomplete, being gleaned from another amateur organisation GAS, it's not a very good deal.
Tom.
are we saying if the internet gos down so does the planes NEVER.?
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Ok once again looks like some customers are confused. So lets make this clear:
RadarBox at the moment does NOT send Live data to the network server. Only 5 minute delayed is sent. Therefore if your not a proffesional version member you will not be sharing Live data so you are not helping the proffesional network.
The Proffesional network requires customers to sign up and be approved to access this Live data. So while we have announced this on the forum 99.99% of customers reading will not be affected.
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It really is time for some of you guys to stop moaning. You requested a monthly subscription and you have been granted that request. The annual subsrciption is only 60 euros. Good grief, even in these hard times it's hardly going to break the bank. You now have a couple of options and not just a straight forward 'take it or leave' situation. Most of us are probably old enough to remember what our hobby used to be like and appreciate the advances we now have. Well done Airnav and keep up the good work !
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Would I pay the professional fee to have access to the live data? I don't think so, as it isn't going to make that much difference to me when viewing traffic outside my live coverage area.
Don't assume that you (or any of us, come to that) would necessarily have the option to do this even if we wanted to.
I infer from the announcement that, just like the real-time FAA/ASDI feed, users will have to justify their use of the data and sign an agreement undertaking to observe restrictions on what they do with it, albeit that in this case the agreement will be with AirNav rather than the FAA.
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Ok once again looks like some customers are confused. So lets make this clear:
RadarBox at the moment does NOT send Live data to the network server. Only 5 minute delayed is sent. Therefore if your not a proffesional version member you will not be sharing Live data so you are not helping the proffesional network.
The Proffesional network requires customers to sign up and be approved to access this Live data. So while we have announced this on the forum 99.99% of customers reading will not be affected.
Sorry AirNav, I'm still a bit confused. You say that none of us is providing live data. So where is it being delayed? Where will the "live data" come from that the professionals will be using?
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I hardly think that it's a case of moaning. And I didn't ask for a monthly subscription. What I asked for is a robust system which does what it says on the tin, and the opportunity, if I have to continue paying for it, to do so as and when I use it.
I've had my RadarBox for almost a year, and enjoyed using it, despite the fact that the software is a bit flaky, and the benefit gained from the network in my case) negligible. I've seen the performance of the software (again, in my case) lacking, and I've also seen the information obtained from the network when I have used it to be questionable. These are issues that I've aired on this forum, and have had a modicum of support.
When you live abroad, on a pension, with what savings you have earning less and less, and with the exchange rate fluctuating between poor and hopeless, you look twice at niceties like the ongoing cost of subscribing to a network which doesn't properly serve its purpose, and which you rarely use.
And if I rightly choose to take issue with the suppliers about the service provided on a forum such as this in order to try and get the supplier (and other users) into discussion, it's not moaning but drawing attention to inadequacies so that all may benefit. Some of you, I think, heap unbridled praise on the manufacturers of this equipment without really considering the issues at hand. They are not in it for the benefit of their health, but to make a profit. As customers we should have input into the equation.
Yes, the concept is good, but it is certainly not infallible, and could be implemented in a better way. Until it is, I've made my decision, rightly or wrongly, to not renew my subscription. My choice. Maybe things will change over the ensuing year, in which case I'll review my decision. I'll watch with interest.
DC
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Don't assume that you (or any of us, come to that) would necessarily have the option to do this even if we wanted to.
Not arguing with that - it was a hypothetical question.
DC, you seem to be confusing a hobby programme with what you would expect from a professional piece of kit. Do you have any software that works exactly as you think that it should? I don't for sure. I think that your description of the software as "flaky" is very harsh and I would be surprised if you continued to use it if it was so. At least I have daily contact with the suppliers and I am confident that they are listening to what we say and will strive to make us all happy - although in reality, I know that it would be impossible to make everybody happy :-) Certainly, I gave up long ago the hope that I would be able to have such a dialogue with Kinetic Aviation regarding the SBS-1.
I wonder if you have ever been involved working with Industry for the provision of flight safety critical information - or even for simulation of such data as used for training. I can tell you exactly what you would get for GBP399 plus 60 Euro's a month - not a lot - lol.
I hope that you are able to continue to get enjoyment from your RadarBox, in spite of your obvious problems with the software and your perception of its inadequacies. You save your money by not renewing your subscription and I'll continue to enjoy the unique Network function of RadarBox :-)
And DC, I'm not having a go at you, but you do seem to be banging the same drum over and over again old chap. I think that we all know exactly how you feel!
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Hi folks!
Sorry to be a bit thick on this one but we are talking here about flights picked up via the internet? Do I take it that 'overhead traffic' will still be real time?
Thanks
BB
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Hi BB,
Traffic picked up by your antenna will always be live :-)
Network traffic is delayed by 5 minutes - unless you can prove that you are a professional user and can afford the subscription for real-time Network traffic.
The port 30003 output, used by PlanePlotter and Squawkbox is live at the moment (a mistake in programming) but will be delayed by 5 minutes when the next software version comes out.
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"Interesting. Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price."
Deadcalm, I'm not sure you read the message correctly: real-time data is only available FOR PROFESSIONALS and FOR PROFESSIONAL USE. It is not a pricing problem: if a user is able to pay the Professional Network price but is not professional he will not be approved.
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"Interesting. Well despite all the posts on this forum about realtime networking, when we were given to understand that this was a no-no because of various possible legal restrictions, it turns out that it is available after all, for the right price."
Deadcalm, I'm not sure you read the message correctly: real-time data is only available FOR PROFESSIONALS and FOR PROFESSIONAL USE. It is not a pricing problem: if a user is able to pay the Professional Network price but is not professional he will not be approved.
Well, I'm a professional, just not in the aviation industry ;-)
Now, can you tell us the criteria used for deciding whether a Professional subscription will be granted? I assume that such information is not secret.....
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"Well, I'm a professional, just not in the aviation industry ;-)"
Can you tell us for what airline/company you work for?
When someone applied to get real-time data he/she has to meet the criteria below and sign a document with all his details. This document has been prepared by our legal team.
Definition of a RadarBox Professional Network user:
“Paragraph 1: A RadarBox Professional Network User is a professional aviation organization with an established flight dispatch or planning function that requires near real time positional flight tracking capabilities. This organization must have direct responsibility for dispatching or tracking aircraft it owns or be contracted by the owner of the aircraft to do so. Examples are airlines, regional air carriers, air taxis, any organization providing dispatch or tracking functions for aircraft owners, flight operation centers, government users and professional flight planning service providers.”
“Paragraph 2: A Government User is a national, federal, state or local government organization, airport authority or authorized organizations acting on behalf of a Government organization.”
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I must say that I do agree with some of DC's comments. My understanding was that AirNav like Kinetic were not able to provide live data due to security issues. It now seems that info can be provided live "at a price". I am sure that if someone was going to use the software for "something other than its intended use" they wouldn't baulk at paying the higher rate.
The "security issue" has always seemed to be a bit of a cop-out for me. I think the cost of hosting the data on the servers and providing the info "live" is where the cost is.
Anyway, I must also say that I think that the monthly payment option is a plus. If everyone shared on Planeplotter, however, there would be no network cost, as long as PP's server could cope :-)
My 2 cents worth.
Cheers
M
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i have gain a great knowledge about money on this site
1.EUR €60 is nothing just cattle feed
2.EUR €389 for the airnav box "sure there giving them away at that price",
3.Annual - EUR € 59.95 per year sure you would spend that on sweets,
now you all must have plenty of money on here, no money recession here boys.
ps:
please send any donation to my email account i accept Credit or debit card through PayPal.
thanks robbie in poor ireland
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Hi,
and if 99% of members dont share data to Airnav network?
We continue pay and no received the service? Or bad service.
if i dont renovate my signature why i continue share my data?
And if the most RB users do the same?
Or RB network can received aniway our RB data?
I think this prices very high.
Regards.
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This has been discussed many times over now.
1.) The Proffesionals are subject to there own audits and security hence anything mentioned regarding the Live Network is only subject to them and not to the rest of the customers. So QF1 points are not valid, as we will be controlling the data and who views it and if and when the authorties please we will pass the data on to them on who is using the service.
2.) Price wise the network is cheap and we have said many times we are NOT concered by drop outs of customers sharing as so far since the network renwals started almost 4 months ago we have NOT seen a negative affect.
So far its only been a minority of users who have made a fuss and keep bringing the subject back up so they might cause more users to follow there ways.
If we deem this is whats happening here we will close this thread as the same points are being mentioned over and over again.
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Hi,
ok support, i hope so.
Thx.
Regards.
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If we deem this is whats happening here we will close this thread as the same points are being mentioned over and over again.
Please don't do this. I believe that this was supposed to be the Kinetic response as well and I thought that this forum would not go down that route. The more users that you get, the increased risk that some will not like what you are doing. As you say, the majority are still happy. I will be very happy to pay my 60 euros once my 12 months are up, because I DO think that it is good value, but I still disagree with the whole "security risk" argument - not necessarily AirNav's stance - more in general. By the time you have a scanner and a pair of binoculars etc etc.
Anyway, 'nuff said.
Cheers
M
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Thanks for the information Airnav Dev, I was interested to know how you defined those able to have real time data.
Sadly the closest my company gets to these definitions is that our products are in passengers' pockets on just about every flight made these days.
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RadarBox at the moment does NOT send Live data to the network server. Only 5 minute delayed is sent.
Are you absolutely sure about this? My analysis of network packets on port 7878 would suggest that aircraft data is being sent LIVE from Radarbox to the Airnav server. Well, LIVE every 10 seconds. Tested as follows:
1. Startup RB with hardware disconnected, and wait 10 minutes.
2. Observe the nearly empty packets being sent every 10 seconds.
"NRG*NE?LP@/..166*Nmprk_fmk_ai*Qamrj_lb*****?LP@0.*
3. Connect the hardware.
4. Observe an immediate stream of much larger packets of data being sent from port 7878. No 5-minute delay before the data is sent.
"NRG*NE?LP@/..166*Nmprk_fmk_ai*Qamrj_lb*****?LP@0.*"NR?*0..7.0/3/.1..6*262.C.*IJK4.0*15...*31.*//5*.*...*34,2414*+1,5721*...*12//*****"NRG*NE?LP@/..166*Nmprk_fmk_ai*Qamrj_lb*****?LP@0.*"NR?*0..7.0/3/.1..6*1A2?64**1....***.*...*34,276/*+0,1563*...******"NRG*NE?LP@/..166*Nmprk_fmk_ai*Qamrj_lb*****?LP@0.*"NR?*0..7.0/3/.1..6*1A2??4**10...*2.1*1.2*.*...*35,1623*+3,0350*...*5504*****
Of course, I could be wrong. I would just like confirmation on whether uploads from RB to Airnav are real-time or 5-min delayed. And is our LIVE data being used to provide the "Professional" service?
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Hi
I might not pay the subscription when the time comes as I rarely use the Network data. However, I will continue share data as it does me little or no harm to me.
If Airnav start networking non ADS-B traffic then I would pay. It is not difficult to see that if 4 boxes can detect an aircraft you have a good idea where it is. Oh and if it is a rough fix then no need to delay.
Finally, I might pay anyway if I want Airnav to do more R and D.
Dudley
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Final words from me, before the thread is unilaterally locked (which is easy if you don't like what you're reading...)
I'm convinced that there's a degree of smoke and mirrors going on here. "Making a fuss" is airing legitimate concerns, and if it is uncomfortable, it may be that there is some substance in those concerns. It would appear, for example, that most of you (including me) don't know whether or not you're transmitting live data - if you are, that opens a whole new world of possibilities...
And, Allocator, If I'd wanted professional equipment, I'd have bought it when I had the opportunity, and yes, I have worked in flight safety, flight investigation and simulation. You're right, I "bang on" about things that concern me, and for which I don't get satisfactory resolution. Meek acceptance resolves nothing. (And I don't take your comments personally!).
For those of you who are content with what you have, and continue to pay for the network as it stands, then that's great. If you want me to shut up, well that's OK, too. I will.
DC
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And is our LIVE data being used to provide the "Professional" service
big question YES or NO or close this thread.
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robbieinderry
If Airnav lose money they go out of business and people lose their jobs. I do not care how they use my data. I do not think you should order Airnav to close the thread.
However I am pleased to get your data on the occassions I try to track ACA855. I will be using this flight later in the year.
Dudley
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First of all from the start we have always said RadarBox is not sending out Live Data, if it was it would not be long before some created there own network or if it was encrypted would not be long before it would unencrypted. (Other than a certain bug that we aware of)
Tarbat making a suggestion like that you need better proof. The RB makes a connection with servers as soon as it logs on to send specific data such as connected time, ip address etc.. and it does then ping the server so we know who is connected. This is not sending ADS-B data.
It seems obvious that a few of you are desperately searching for something to bring us to our knees.
We are getting annoyed but so called theories being pulled out without any proof . We are very open company and the forum proves this as we answer many questions that other companies would just ignore. Furthermore we listen which has been proved by the network price drop and the monthly charges.
BUT we will not stand for damaging rumours which have no proof and just based on theories. This is damaging for our business and for our brand let alone the ADS-B home market.
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Well said, Airnav. Close the thread now as it is starting to get just a bit silly !
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Airnav, as I said in my post - "I could be wrong". I was just trying to understand what extra data was being sent as soon as I plugged in the hardware, data that wasn't being sent without the hardware connected. If you're stating categorically that data sent to the Airnav servers is 5-minute delayed, that's good enough for me.
I just wonder where all these "Professional" users are going to get their live data from.
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There are many other sites across the world which are not sharing to network or are run by us as well. So there is plenty for them.
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AirNAv,
"It seems obvious that a few of you are desperately searching for something to bring us to our knees."
This is not the sort of statement I expect from a professional company. It paints for me a picture of a couple of nerds in a unit on a trading estate. I'm not trying to "bring you to your knees" and I'm pretty sure no one else on here is either. How could that possibly be in our interest? I think the ANRB software is the best available, despite many bugs and petty annoyances. What many of us users want, some pensioners like me, is value for money.
Many of us use PlanePlotter from COAA which, for a one-off payment of half of what you are charging per annum, gives access to a huge network of sharers. Time and again I track aircraft up and down and across the British Isles and Ireland which never show up on the ANRB network. This brings home to us just how unsatisfactory the ANRB network is.
Now you are going to offer professionals a real-time network, something which you deny us and we are naturally a bit miffed. We are also miffed that you are going to make a lot more money out of data we provide to you whilst still asking us to pay to share data from others. My suggestion is that you re-introduce the original idea you had, crediting some network time to those of us who share their data.
Far from wanting to bring your company to its knees we want to share in your success.
Tom
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I totally agree with viking9 !
Hosch
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Many of us use PlanePlotter from COAA which, for a one-off payment of half of what you are charging per annum, gives access to a huge network of sharers. Time and again I track aircraft up and down and across the British Isles and Ireland which never show up on the ANRB network. This brings home to us just how unsatisfactory the ANRB network is.
Now, being an engineer, that sort of thing would be an itch that I can't scratch, and I would have to investigate the problem, work out what the cause is, and fix it.
Is this because the RB users don't provide enough data? Might there be a way of allowing others to supply network data if that is the case? Or is it down to some faults in the logic of the network side of things?
I would be more than happy to provide what information I can to help out, but some directed suggestions would be useful. We already know that live<->network transitions are problematic, but it would be nice to get this understood and properly fixed in v2.1 rather than have another 6 months of problems before a future release appears.
Viking's absolutely right BTW, the last thing any of us want is to stop Airnav succeeding, but we would like the bug numbers reduced a lot please.
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I think that this is all getting a bit silly. There are forum members here who insist that they want AirNav to succeed, but seem to take every opportunity to criticise them. Every time AirNav try to answer questions, no matter how daft the questions are, they are just hit with another criticism.
Maybe they should do what Kinetic have done - refuse to answer any questions and hide behind the distributor. At least then nobody would have anything to criticise - but we would all be worse off.
I might be paranoid, but I do wonder now if this is a deliberate attack organised by the opposition. I'm getting really tired of this. This used to be a forum where users could help each other and learn how to use RadarBox to its best effect - now it's just "lets have a go at AirNav and see what we can get for nothing"
I'm not enjoying being a member of the forum at the moment and it's not AirNav that I am blaming for that :-( Any new visitors to the forum will think that we are a bunch of idiots.
Why not just shut down the forum all together, then we can all stumble around in the dark - or is that what the minority are trying to do, to spoil it for the majority. That's what you are doing for me.
Not happy!
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Tarbat making a suggestion like that you need better proof. The RB makes a connection with servers as soon as it logs on to send specific data such as connected time, ip address etc.. and it does then ping the server so we know who is connected. This is not sending ADS-B data.
So what data is being sent? As soon as I plug the Radarbox in, the data traffic triples, and that's with only 2-3 aircraft on screen. And why doesn't the amount of data increase after the 5 minute delay? Radarbox software was running all the time throughout this test.
This graph from Wireshark illustrates what I'm saying.
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3149/3281225069_19e5a14434_o.gif)
It seems obvious that a few of you are desperately searching for something to bring us to our knees.
As others have said, why on earth would I want to "bring you to your knees!?!! I love Radarbox, I'm just trying to get an honest answer to an honest question. When I tick the box to share data, what exactly am I sharing, and is it live or 5-minute delayed. And if this turns out to be a bug, then better that we know about it now.
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I have been away from the forum for a while but I agree with Allocator about this topic getting a bit out of hand, this used to be a friendly place. I will put my tin hat on ;-)
If the Radar Box network is unsatisfactory why do members what to be part of it?
Also I think Airnav should make the default not to share data, then users can make their own mind up. It should NOT be a requirement to make that choice every time the program is started.
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Silly, it certainly isn't. Potentially important, it most certainly is. If your data is being freely milked for other commercial use, potentially illegally, are you all OK with that? I'm not. I need to be firmly reassured, without knee-jerk and hysterical reaction. And why anyone should think this commentary is in any way associated with competitor's activities, heaven only knows.
DC
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Allocator,
A few minutes ago you wrote, "I might be paranoid, but I do wonder now if this is a deliberate attack organised by the opposition. I'm getting really tired of this. This used to be a forum where users could help each other and learn how to use RadarBox to its best effect - now it's just "lets have a go at AirNav and see what we can get for nothing"
I'm beginning to think you are getting paranoid and that you work for AirNav. For the record, I do not personally know any other RadarBox users though I do know a few SBS-1 users, two of whom recently bought RadarBox after seeing mine. I have given two presentations of ANRB to members of the RBL and am due to be the guest speaker with my presentation of ANRB at the County Commitee meeting of the RBL in Bury St Edmunds on Thursday April 2nd. (All are welcome to the meeting by the way). My presentation in Powerpoint includes a brief history of RADAR and IFF. At the last presentation we had a serving RAF SATCO and a retired Air Vice-Marshal who were astounded at the amount of information provided by the RB. So, to suggest that I have an interest in the downfall of AirNav is patently ridiculous. I'm giving them free advertising.
I do get the impression, when reading the remarks of the AirNAv people that they are not a very sophisticated bunch at the UK end of things. I wonder what the principals of AirNav in the USA would think of staff in the UK who cannot take constructive criticism from their users.
One last thing. Commercial ADS-B receivers and repeaters are going to start to come one the market very soon. The companies that produce them may also find it attractive to bring an amateur product to the market, so if I were AirNav I'd be bending over backwards to keep my current customer base happy.
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Could AirNav please, in a future update - store the USERS setting for the share Flight Data - Failure to do this could be considered, in the UK to be a criminal offence under the Computer Misuse Acts.
It may even be an offence under European Law as well.
Users should be aware of the act of sharing data.
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The only law that I am aware of concerning data in the UK is the Data Protection Act. This only applies to data that can positively identify an individual.
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I'm beginning to think you are getting paranoid and that you work for AirNav.
Think what you like my friend. I've had enough for today without a personal attack - you've achieved your aim in making me sign off the forum this evening.
Too much nastiness.
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Anyone else find my last post nasty and personal?
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I can't believe that there is anyone who buys a RadarBox who doesn't realise that one of its primary purposes is to share data on the network. If someone, including AirNav, makes money from it, what do I care? I'm getting the network that I paid for.
Our aim here is surely to enjoy being aviation enthusiasts - I'm sure there must be many people reading this and similar threads thinking "why don't people with a RadarBox get on with enjoying the facilities that this marvellous piece of kit gives them" rather than wasting their lives attacking the suppliers?".
Nothing's perfect, but AirNav were and are getting on with bug fixing and improving the product long before this thread started. Let's let them get on with it. People who don't want to pay for the network need not do so, and don't need to keep going on about it.
Just my opinion.
Rod
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Hi
How could anybody think that a phrase like
"I'm beginning to think you are getting paranoid"
Could be viewed as personal.
Dudley
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Rod,
Couldnt agree with you more.
At last a voice of reason along with Allocator.
A lot of this is going above my head , even so I am getting a bit cheesed off with all the petty name calling etc.
If any one has a problem with Air Nav and its products could you not contact them directly rather than most of us having to read this , at times , nonsense.
Let us just get on with enjoying our hobby , which is made all the more enjoyable by the ANRB.
Regards
Phil
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Let us just get on with enjoying our hobby , which is made all the more enjoyable by the ANRB.
Regards
Phil
Hear, hear roger that!
Paul@cyyb
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We have decided to lock this thread.
AirNav Systems is a different company, honest, transparent and we want to keep this forum an interesting place as it always have been. We cannot accept that 3 or 4 users that constantly complaint and send negative comments turn some threads into a nightmare that no one is interested in participating.
As usually we are open to suggestions and comments, both here or on our support email ( [email protected] ).
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I couldn't agree more. If you have a problem with Airnav cointact them and leave the rest of us to enjoy our hobby.
Stuart